Subject: Re: Apple II - how much is it worth?
From: supertimer@aol.com (Supertimer)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple2
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Date: 02 Sep 1999 06:48:24 GMT
References: <pmd-0109992351320001@stpras01-p17.mts.net>
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pmd@NETescape.ca (Perry Dueck) wrote:

>supertimer@aol.com (Supertimer) wrote:
>
>> They had a feature article out to
>> celebrate the Apple IIe when sales of that unit hit the 5
>> million mark in the late 1980s.
>
>In the recently published book, "Apple Confidential" by Owen W. Linzmayer,
>there is an Apple II Timeline on pages 7 and 8 and it shows that the Apple
>II installed base in the second half of 1977 was 570 units.
>
>In 1978, the installed base had grown to 8,170 units.
>
>Then in 1979, the Apple II Plus was introduced and shortly thereafter, the
>Apple II installed base was at 43,270.
>
>By 1980, the Apple II installed base had grown to 121,370.
>
>1981...301,370.
>1982...580,370
>1983...1,000,000
>1984...2,000,000
>
>Presumably, these numbers include all models of the Apple II up to that
>point in time (][, ][ Plus, //e).
>
>Now, I would tend to believe that after the introduction of the Apple ][
>Plus in 1979, the original Apple ][ motherboard would have been phased out
>of production shortly thereafter. Keep in mind that with the original
>Apple ][, the very first one that rolled off the assembly line had a
>serial number of #2000, if memory serves me correctly.

Actually, csa2 reader Alan Tuttle has just pointed out that they
did sell the Apple II into 1982 even after the II+ was introduced.
If you think about it, the Apple II series was just picking up
steam in the early 1980s.  In 1984, several things were
happening.  The Apple II was hot at the time and Apple
released basically 2 new II computers, the Apple IIc and the
Apple IIe Professional.  Yes, the IIe was the same old IIe,
but the Professional setup was a bestseller.  This was the IIe
bundled with Ext. 80 column card, green Monitor II, and the
DuoDisk drives.  Look at the leap in numbers between 1983
and 1984 to see why this was justified.

Your source, Apple Confidential, my source, II at Work, and
Alan Tuttle's source, Apple Product Facts, all agree.  The
Apple II, sold from between 1978 to 1982, sold about 100,000
units.  The Apple II Plus sold 1 million.  The reason the
figures are low at the beginning but bigger later on was that
the Apple II series as a whole picked up steam in the early
1980s, just as Apple Confidential shows above.

The Apple IIe later broke the 5 million mark.

>I find it very hard to believe that the original Apple ][ had a production
>number total of 100,000 units...I believe it would be more around 40,000
>to 50,000 units...somewheres around that total.

The original Apple II continued to sell along side the
Apple II Plus just as the IIe continued to sell along side
the IIGS.  That's why the numbers of both continued to
increase throughout their production.

>> 100,000 units is not a lot if you consider that Apple gave
>> them away to many, many schools.  That whet their
>> appetites for the eventual purchases of II+ and IIe units
>> which was what really generated profit for Apple.
>
>Take a look at the above numbers which I have supplied, which I believe to
>be very accurate. Owen W. Linzmayer has done a tremendous job with his
>book "Apple Confidential", and he debunks a lot of misconceptions and half
>truths which have come to be blindly accepted by most people as the truth
>regarding the history of Apple. He also reveals a lot of stuff that has
>never been told before, and he did it all through exhaustive research in
>order to be very very accurate.
>
>> I read an old article in A+ magazine about the III.  The
>> article was about Titan Technology's "Apple IIe in a III"
>> card for the Apple III and in the first paragraph, they
>> mentioned that the number of Apple IIIs.  I don't remember
>> for sure the figure, but I think it was around 100,000 units.
>
>That is actually very close. The total number of installed Apple III units
>was approximately 120,000, at the time when Apple discontinued the Apple
>III line in 1984, again, according to Owen W. Linzmayer's book, "Apple
>Confidential". That number would include both the III and the III Plus
>models, of course.

Exactly.  Just as Linzmayer did his research, computer
magazines usually do not dump out numbers without
researching them.  I bet A+ did its research too and if
you break down the III and III Plus numbers, the III would
have sold approximately 100,000 and the III+ approximately
20,000.

>> Considering that, which do we hear about more?  The
>> original Apple II or the Apple III?  100,000 units is not
>> a lot for really the first mass produced PC.
>
>The Apple II came out during a different time era than the Apple III. When
>the Apple II came out, microcomputers were not a commonplace item. 1980
>(Apple III) was a whole different ballgame compared to 1977 (Apple II).
>
>I believe that 100,000 to be a grossly inaccurate number regarding the
>number of original ][ models. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I find it hard to
>believe that Apple would have continued to manufacture and sell the
>original ][ after they introduced the updated ][ Plus.

I believe that both (continued manufacture of the II and
the 100,000 approximate figure) are correct.

The original II continued to be sold until 1982, which
was just before the Apple II line's momentum reached
fusion point.  Then boom, the II+ sales skyrocketted
and the IIe caught the full force of the movement which
continued to carry it forward for nearly a decade!